Correct. I have a dual role. I'm the local organizer here in Chicago for Code for America, and I'm also a consultant with the Smart Chicago Collaborative, which is a nonprofit group here in Chicago. Yeah, and both of those are, or one or both of those are involved with a lot of HackFests and contributing open code for people to get that data that's government data and government information. Can you tell a little bit about the HackFests and how Code for America and the Chicago Smart Collaborative are involved in those, and how do you work in those?

Well, the OpenGov Hack Nights are actually being run by Derek Eder and Juan Velez with OpenCity. They've been doing these Hack Nights at a place called 1871, which is a co-working space in Chicago's Merchandise Mart, for about the past year. We have them every Tuesday night at 6 p. m. , same place, same time, and that's where a lot of sort of volunteer coders go to work on projects that they want to spend more time on than just like a weekend event. My role with Smart Chicago Collaborative, we are investing in several different apps that we pay people full-time money to help develop. One of these apps is called Foodborne Chicago that searches Twitter for tweets about food poisoning.

And once it finds that app, it'll tweet back at the author saying, hey, I'm sorry, you're sick.

And with that information, we can actually submit a 3-1-1 request to the city to send a food inspector to that restaurant. So these are apps that are actually really interacting with people. These aren't just like, oh, I put this thing kind of up on the web. But it's, it's. These are real apps that do, that are performing a public service. And so I'm fortunate to be in Chicago's civic technology scene where we're building both big things like Foodborne and then small things like an app that will tell you when your local police meeting is. Or how to find your nearest polling place or how to find your nearest polling place. So we're kind of working on both a big level and a smaller level. Yeah, I think it's really interesting to see. I mean, I've spoken with Dan X. O'Neill and Paul Baker about the open government. And it's really fascinating to see what's happening here in Chicago around civic hacking and the hack fest that you were just recently doing.

I mean, they were weekend events, though, that were. Well, we've, this summer we've had a lot of hackathons in Chicago. I think the earliest one that we've had this year was the, we, the Chicago Police Department recently launched an API to help communicate community concerns to Chicago Police Department through a program called CAPS. And so we had a hackathon at Google to sort of play with that API and see what we could do with it. We recently just finished the National Day of Civic Hacking, which we had three simultaneous events in Chicago. We had a hackathon that was focused on immigration in Chicago's Pilsen neighborhood. We had a youth-centered hackathon at Adler Planetarium. And then we had more of a general hackathon at 1871.

I started out in the public sector as a field representative for the Illinois Department of Employment Security. I got hired on just as the recession was beginning and the bottom was dropping out and there were just lines and lines of people out the door. And so, I, you know, I show up on my first day of work. I'm excited. I'm ready to, you know, help my community during this kind of rough time. I get on my computer and it's a DOS program. I am not, it is a DOS-based program that is probably older than I am. And I, you know, because I had recently gotten out of college and had been, you know, used to having computer labs with the latest and greatest. I had a smartphone. And I'm looking at this and I'm going, you, this is unreal.

So, I ran towards the civic technologists as fast as I could go. And I had gotten an invite to a group called Urban Geek Drinks that Justin Massa had started to sort of pull together people who were involved in urban policy and technology and kind of put them all in one room. And through that, I met Derek Eater with Open City and Paul Baker and Dan O'Neill and just sort of, that's sort of how I got involved. When Code for America launched its brigade program, I wanted to get involved because I think Code for America is doing just phenomenal work in this area and wanted to be able to contribute in a way that was more than just trying to start a meetup group. And so, I proposed a plan to brigade on how to sort of expand the universe in terms of civic technology issues. And through that, I got more involved in Smart Chicago and just kind of went from there. And you use the term brigade captain. That was kind of interesting.

So, the brigade program started last October in about 30, and we're now in 34 different cities. So, this is national. This is a national program. So, in most cities, these are the individuals who are organizing the very first hackathons these cities have had who are doing the hard sort of tasks. We're in the task of gathering all the people together in a room and having them focus on using technology to solve civic problems. In Chicago, we're fortunate that we've already been through that wall, that we already have a very active open government group. Joe Jomonska and Dan O'Neill started OpenGov Chicago probably about five years ago. And so, when the brigade program started, we wanted to make sure that, you know, we weren't just duplicating efforts.

And so, where in most cities, they're trying to start groups. In Chicago, we're more of a support role.

And we also use what we've learned here in Chicago and sort of export those lessons and those code bases that we've developed to other younger cities.

So, I mean, if I was in a city that was looking at wanting to get involved with Code for America, you know, I live in some, not the biggest metropolitan area, or I'm even maybe out in the suburbs and I want to do something, is that something that would be, like, for example, myself, I live in Crystal Lake.

Yeah, absolutely. You can go to brigade. codeforamerica. org.

And there'll be sort of a sign-up sheet where you can say, hey, I'm a coder, I have these skills, I'm a community organizer, I have these skills, I have these challenges that I'm dealing with, and that will let national headquarters know who you are. If there's something already in your area, they will introduce you to the local organizer there. If there's nobody there, then they'll connect you with resources on how you can start your own brigade in your city and how you can sort of gain access to all the resources and the network that Code for America has to offer.

Like, if you already have a presence, is this something that could be, is it something that really has to be kind of a stand-alone thing?

Not at all. Chicago doesn't have, like, its own separate Code for America meet-up group. We've just sort of co-opted the meet-up groups and the weekly hack nights that already existed. To borrow an Army term, you sort of stay in your lane or don't fix what's not broken.

And so for groups that are already active in their communities and already doing hackathons and things with civic technology, you don't have to start your whole separate thing to be involved in Code for America. I know New York did something similar in that they co-opted some of the groups. And I know there's groups in D. C. that were already working on stuff before they got involved in Brigade. So by all means, you can sort of co-opt and connect with Code for America's network even if you already have a group that kind of does the same thing.

So it could be a great way to augment an existing community, give them some more purpose than just pizza and the latest libraries. One of the things I had been thinking about was recently there's been a lot of talk about GNSA and Snowden and all this worries about FISA. It seems like there's a potential for cracking down on what seems to have been like a lot of good work that groups like Code for America have already started.

I think the biggest sort of shouts of criticism and concern and the people who are really adamant about the government sort of behaving itself when it comes to these things are the same group of people who are involved in civic technology and how we can use the power of technology for good and how we can use open government data for good. So, I mean, obviously there's been talk in my circles because these circles are the people who are yelling about the NSA thing. But I don't think it limits or is a barrier to the kind of work that we're doing in which we're using information that the government produces as a byproduct. It's fuel and so I think it's a different problem set than what we do in the hack nights and in sort of a civic hacking and technology community. So what you're dealing with is mostly stuff that's been already released. It's openly and intentionally available for people to tap into and utilize so people don't have to worry about having to run to Bolivia. Yeah, I mean, my viewpoint on it is what can be released without violating privacy should be released. And I know the city of Chicago has been particularly careful about making sure that when it does release geocoded information, it doesn't give any way any personally identifying information. Most recent example, the city recently released energy use of statistics by census tract. The exception with that is there's a couple of tracks that they've actually merged because there was in some places there was just one building and they didn't want that one building to be able to identify their energy uses. They wanted to be able to mix it up some to sort of obfuscate a little bit. With the crime statistics, they do the same thing. They give a range of addresses. The city has released 10 years of crime data and gotten it down to the block level, which gives you really good information. But at the same time, they keep that range in there so you can identify the person behind the crime report. You protect victims. And so I think the city's done a good job of making sure that while they're opening up data, they're not opening up anything personal. The exception being lobbyist data, which if you're lobbying the city, your name's going to be out there. Right, right. So some of those things that have to do with money and political transparency, they'll likely have names. Well, Pilsen is where we held the MiGRAHAC. And so one of the things that we were kind of proud of, and if we have time, I'd like to throw that in. Pilsen recently had a startup incubator called Cibola that's designed to sort of spur startups within the Hispanic community. And I think it was important to not only have that in neighborhoods that are not downtown, I think it was also important for us to have one of our hackathons in the neighborhoods. 1871 is fantastic. I can't say enough good things about it, but it's in a fortress. Merchandise marts, a huge building. And while it's nice being sort of in a five-mile radius of all the tech startups, it's also important to be out in the neighborhood so we connect with everyday residents so that when we make apps that solve civic problems, we're interacting with everyday residents in order to make sure that our stuff works for them. Okay, and we'll go ahead and include this in the interview because I want to ask, it's kind of interesting what you just said is bringing the developers into a community and probably trying to pull developers out from that community. Did you ever have people who are just regular old citizens who are not tech dev types come out and check out what's going on? Almost every week. We have, the ratio is about 60-40 depending on kind of what's going on. One of the things that, one of the apps that I'm sort of most proud of is the schoolcuts. org app. Chicago recently closed a great many number of schools and during that process it was hard for parents to get good information. And so, essentially, a group of developers partnered up with a parent organization to sort of learn what questions did parents have, what concerns did they have, and they created this whole site that put the information in one spot. And explained everything that was going on, why CPS was wanting to close the school, where that child is going next, and sort of built the entire app around the concerns of the parent groups. And I think it's one of the best apps that's come out this year. The other thing that we've done is SmartChicago Collaborative has started a user testing group. We have about 400 testers in all 50 wards in the city, so that when we go to, once we build an app, we can test it with everyday resonance to make sure that it actually makes sense to someone who doesn't know how to program or has never been to a hackathon. That way we sort of have a reality check when we start to create this stuff.

Yes.

And has any, I talked with Dan X O'Neill back when he was first launching that, has there been any interesting projects that have come out of that? So we've just run through our first program test with Tom Campare's go-to-school app. The app is mobile-friendly. It works on phones. It works on computers. It's essentially, you put in your child's school. You say what time you need to get to school, and it'll give you transit directions, walking directions, or driving directions to that school. It's designed to make it easy for parents to, for that first few weeks of school when you're still trying to find your routine. We did a test in Inglewood, and then we did a test in Uptown to test those apps to make sure they made sense. We did that early July. That way Tom has enough time to revamp the app and re-release it when they start the school year. Okay, so these are things that are actively being adopted. Yes. Oh wow, that's really cool. It's pretty neat to have a conversation with somebody when they're just launching something, and then hear about how it's actually in people's hands, potentially changing school attendance levels. So that's going to reap rewards down the line. Yes, we're very excited because it was one of those apps that sort of made sense because we already knew there would be a bunch of people who would use it. And it's a fairly simple problem, but at the same time, he's built it in a way that caters to parents. I mean, he's a Chicago public school parent himself. It remembers your school. So, you know, if your child gets sick one morning, and you're, instead of searching frantically for what the sick call number is, you pull up the app. It remembers where your child goes to school, and it lists the sick call number just right there at the bottom so that you can just call the school, and it's done.

So by making information more accessible, it might produce the, what do they say, that generally if a, I remember reading a statistic that said that if a child was even suspended once, that their likelihood of dropping out of high school went up, you know, multiple times. It wasn't a simple thing. So even something as simple as making sure that attendance is good and it could probably have long-term effects on their life. That has to be pretty satisfying, knowing that that's out there and actually being used. Yeah, I know, well, it'll be interesting once school gets started and to watch the use of statistics. I don't know how if it'll actually affect school attendance. I don't know how much of that impact it'll have. I know another app that Tom's made sort of along the same lines is the Safe Haven app, so that when kids are walking to school or hanging out during the summer, they can easily identify safe places to go during the summer if they need to get out of trouble. So we're kind of watching the use of statistics on that carefully to see, you know, is this being used and is this having an impact.

It's a community safety application. Interesting. Wow. So there's, is the official repo to go look at some of these projects, is it the Gov in Trenches? No, the two apps, the Tom Capare's app is on his personal GitHub account. If you go to SmartChicagoApps. org, it lists all the apps that we've developed as SmartChicago and all the apps that we're hosting. We provide free hosting for civic app developers, and I believe on that site it'll also link you to the GitHub repositories. Depending on who built it, it'll go to their own repository. Yeah, no, sorry, I misread that. The Gov in Trenches is your personal repo. Okay, so yeah, I'll definitely link to the SmartChicago apps, and yeah, it has lots of apps that look like they could be very useful for a lot of people. The other good website to look for is OpenCityApps. org. OpenCityApps is Derek and Derek Eater's, his group's GitHub repository kind of page and application gallery, and on that site, all the GitHub repositories for their sites are listed as well. Okay, great. I will definitely link to these in the show notes. Well, thank you again for taking the time to sit down with me, Chris.